2022.11.25
Daijiro Mizuno X Synflux: "Right Now, 'Play' is Important for Fashion – Considering the Connection Between Fashion Design & Technology"
With Professor Daijiro Mizuno of Kyoto Institute of Technology's Future Design and Engineering, we've launched the special feature series 'Fashion Design & Technology'. For the second installment, we held an online roundtable discussion with the team from the Speculative Fashion Laboratory 'Synflux Co., Ltd.'.
Recently, Professor Mizuno made headlines with the publication of "サステナブル・ファッション: ありうるかもしれない未来" They shared their expert perspectives on how to connect future fashion design with technology and discussed key points to focus on.
PROFILE
Daijiro Mizuno
Born in 1979. Professor at the Future Design Engineering Department, Kyoto Institute of Technology, and Special Invited Professor at Keio University Graduate School. Finished postgraduate program at the Royal College of Art, Doctor of Fine Arts (Fashion Design). Conducts practical research and criticism to bridge design and society. Recent publications include 『サステナブル・ファッション: ありうるかもしれない未来』. Other works include 『サーキューラー・デザイン』『クリティカルワード・ファッションスタディーズ』『インクルーシブデザイン』『リアル・アノニマスデザイン』 (all co-authored). Also edited "vanitas" and others.
PROFILE
Kazuya Kawasaki
CEO at Synflux Co., Ltd.
Born in 1991. A speculative fashion designer. Completed a master's program in the XD program at Keio University Graduate School of Media and Governance. Specializes in practical research on design research and fashion design. Major awards include the H&M Foundation Global Change Award Special Prize, selection as the Art Division Jury Recommended Work at the Agency for Cultural Affairs' Media Arts Festival, and the Wired Creative Hack Award. Also selected for Forbes Japan 30 under 30 2019 and WWD JAPAN NEXT LEADERS 2020. Committee member of the Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry's "Future Fashion Study Group". Supervisor and editor of "SPECULATIONS" (BNN, 2019), co-author of "Critical Word Fashion Studies" (Film Art Company, 2022), and co-editor of "Sustainable Fashion" (Gakugei Publishing, 2022).
PROFILE
Kotaro Sano
CDO at Synflux Co., Ltd.
A speculative fashion designer born in 1998. Graduated from Keio University's Faculty of Environment and Information Studies. Conducts research and development on new garment design methods applying computational design and biodesign. Recently, in collaboration with experts in algorithmic design, has been focusing on the development of clothing design methods optimized for the body and environment, applying differential geometry and evolutionary algorithms. Major awards include the H&M Foundation Global Change Award Special Prize and the Wired Creative Hack Award. Co-editor of "Sustainable Fashion" (Gakugei Publishing, 2022).
PROFILE
Hiroki Okamoto
CTO at Synflux Co., Ltd.
Born in 1987. An algorithmic architect. Completed his master's program in Architecture at Tokyo University of Science Graduate School of Engineering and the Media Expression Major at the Institute of Advanced Media Arts and Sciences (IAMAS). After working at the design firm Noise Inc., now active as part of the collective v0id (Void), which consists of members with diverse backgrounds in architecture, photography, graphics, and more. Conducts cross-disciplinary activities in video production, exhibition installations, interior design, fashion design, etc. Major awards include the MADD. Award 2019 Excellence Award, ADAA (Asia Digital Art Award) 2019 winner, and International Talent Support: ITS 2020 Finalist. Joined Synflux in 2021.
PROFILE
Yoko Fujishima
Research Lead at Synflux Inc.
Born in 1988. A fashion researcher. After studying fashion design at the University of the Arts London (Central Saint Martins), he focused on research in fashion and media, and the history of Japan's fashion industry. He joined ZOZO Technologies in 2019. After serving as a research scientist at the ZOZO Research Institute, he became the editor-in-chief of 'Fashion Tech News'. He is a member of the 'Research Group on Future Fashion' organized by the Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry. He joined Synflux in 2022 and concurrently serves as a specially appointed lecturer at the Meiji University Faculty of Commerce and a guest researcher at the RIKEN Center for Advanced Intelligence Project. His edited book is 'クリティカル・ワード ファッションスタディーズ' (Film Art, 2022), he co-authored 'ソーシャルメディア・スタディーズ' (Hokujusha Publishing, 2021), and he co-translated 'ファッションと哲学' (Film Art, 2018).
The Response to 'Sustainable Fashion'
MizunoThis September, you published a book titled 『サステナブル・ファッション ありうるかもしれない未来』. Could you please first tell me about the kind of expectations and responses Synflux has received regarding this book?
KawasakiIn terms of responses, I believe many people found it practical. The book includes not only theories and cases of sustainable fashion around the world, but also a comprehensive introduction to what Synflux does and the actual technologies and methods used. Therefore, I assume that is what drew attention.
It has been 15 years since the study of sustainable fashion began to flourish at the Centre for Sustainable Fashion at the London College of Fashion in 2008. During that time, it became the moment to present an ideology where social ideas and social implementation, deep thought, and practice fused inseparably, which we emphasized in both our business at Synflux and this book.
MizunoI see. Sano, you also contributed to this book, how was the feedback?
SanoIn the book, I mainly took on the role of visualizing and verbalizing 'a possible future for fashion'. The methodologies of 'speculative design' or 'design fiction' that I introduced in Chapter 6 allow for imagining the 'potential future', which is also the subtitle.
I often received comments from readers saying that through this book, they gained an understanding of the connection between these design methodologies used for contemplating the future and fashion design.
MizunoIt's surprising to think that speculative design and fashion design are actually related. Anthony Dunne refers to fashion designer Hussein Chalayan in his book 'Speculative Design'.
Are there few people who understand that there are similarities between future orientation in fashion design and speculative design?
SanoInitially, the customary 'collection' in the fashion industry is a design cycle that constantly attempts to capture the world half a year or a year ahead, so I would say fashion design and future aspiration were always close.
However, when it comes to 'technology', the fashion domain, where craftsmanship is still valued, may not have thought much about the connection with science and technology.
MizunoI'd also like to hear from Okamoto. As an architect, you've guided and collaborated with Sano and Kawasaki since they were part of the Daijiro Mizuno research group at Keio University SFC.
In terms of the relationship between architecture and fashion, fashion designers are now incorporating tools like Substance 3D, Blender, and Cinema 4D, which traditionally weren't used in the fashion industry. They are assembling the design process while bridging multiple software and data formats.
In terms of the relationship between architecture and fashion, fashion designers are now incorporating tools like Substance 3D, Blender, and Cinema 4D, which traditionally weren't used in the fashion industry. They are assembling the design process while bridging multiple software and data formats.
How do you perceive this trend of expanding digital tools for design from your standpoint, Okamoto?
OkamotoI've been particularly interested in how the digital environment changes design. Since architecture is also my base, if I compare it with architecture, the digital trend in architecture started in the 80s and 90s.
At that time, it was more like "Let's just try something because there might be potential," and whilst people said, "It's meaningless, you're just playing with sculptures," it was a time of exploring while playing, thinking, "No, there might be something beyond that."
Then a change occurred in the 2000s, 'play' finally saturated, and it led to the next step, in other words, it linked to specific products. It wasn't with a preconceived goal, but a development that came from thinking about how to do it while playing.
However, in fashion, it surpassed 'play' from the beginning and plunged toward the goal, so the sense of speed was entirely different. I strongly felt that difference in the relationship between architecture and fashion.
At that time, it was more like "Let's just try something because there might be potential," and whilst people said, "It's meaningless, you're just playing with sculptures," it was a time of exploring while playing, thinking, "No, there might be something beyond that."
Then a change occurred in the 2000s, 'play' finally saturated, and it led to the next step, in other words, it linked to specific products. It wasn't with a preconceived goal, but a development that came from thinking about how to do it while playing.
However, in fashion, it surpassed 'play' from the beginning and plunged toward the goal, so the sense of speed was entirely different. I strongly felt that difference in the relationship between architecture and fashion.
MizunoSo, on the other hand, is the fashion design side something that should 'play more'?
OkamotoIn my perspective, It's better to play as much as possible. The more practical you become, the more other possibilities you drop, I think.
Within that context, 'play' can create things from different value sets. I believe that if you can pick up on that, it will lead to the future, not just the near future.
What Sort of 'Play' to Incorporate
MizunoToday's theme for the roundtable is 'Fashion Design & Technology', but from Okamoto, we heard that 'play' is important. It's a suggestion that the exploration of potential tends to become dwarfed when it is for commercial purposes.
Now, when it comes to playing, where and what tools are hot to play with from your perspective, Okamoto?
OkamotoIt's important to use algorithms for modeling, and of course, Houdini, which can be applied to fashion, is crucial. But not only that, but also software like TouchDesigner, which is powerful for real-time processing, are recommended even for people who are not programmers but are based on design and can do programming.
In particular, TouchDesigner is often used in the audiovisual (AV) field and treats sound and video as equivalent. Once you drop it into digital, it's incredibly crucial to have a sense that you can treat any media equally, not just audio and video.
Actually, I'm also a VJ, and Sano told me he felt like there was a connection between the VJ work he saw and making clothes.
MizunoWhat elements did Sano see in Okamoto's VJ work that led him to interpret it as being potentially connected to clothing design, rather than a rational design method, but rather a visual representation of information?
SanoI thought VJ technology and creativity could be applied to 'knitwear' in particular. When I saw VJ work like Okamoto's that generates one pixel at a time, there was a moment when the projected 'one pixel' and the 'one stitch' of knit that the knitting machine spit out based on the bitmap data looked like the same structure, and I felt a lot of common points as an expression method.
In the world of visual programming, there is a term called 'dot by dot' (where images and videos are displayed at a ratio of one pixel per dot). If so, in the world of fashion, it would be 'dot for knit'.
MizunoThat's interesting. When you trace the origin of computers, you end up with a Jacquard loom that programmed 'warp and weft' control with punch cards, but just like that, you've found a common point between 'pixel' and clothing.
Fujishima, in expanding digital technology activities at Synflux, what do you want to incorporate as a point of 'play'?
FujishimaMy interest lies less in the way clothes are made, or the things that are made, than in how desires for clothes change as a result of these things, how the industrial structure and its cycle change.
Through these endeavors, I want to consider what changes can be brought about in the traditional discussion around fashion, such as 'the choice of clothes as self-expression,' 'involvement with fashion trends'.
MizunoI see. Okamoto and Sano are interested in 'play' in application, but Fujishima, you're interested in people's 'play' in implications.
Especially based on the premise of the extension of the digital environment and technology, is there anything you're interested in that could happen in the implications of people wearing clothes?
FujishimaInstead of analyzing based on the autonomous desires and intentions of the individual wearing the clothes, I focus on how these are shaped within the context of the platform's structure. I'm particularly interested in not just the development of individual pieces in digital fashion, but how the rules surrounding them are established, how platform mechanisms are created, what objectives and incentives are set, and the politics and interactions with individual identities that emerge from this.
MizunoIt's fascinating to hear how Synflux is evolving into something like a think tank. If we'll go back to the first question, Kawasaki, what are you currently interested in?
KawasakiI listened to the discussion and thought that 'play' is an important keyword. However, thinking about play and development or business as separate entities is simply romanticizing, and is an old-fashioned dichotomy.
Rather, I think it is important to move forward with practices where play and business become one. This essentially means balancing the premise of implementing applications with implications, and contemplating implications with the premise of applications.
In this sense, Web3 and metaverse, which Synflux is also focusing on, are areas with plenty of room and gap for play. We are interested in how we can propose alternative implications with play against the values currently relied on by Web3 and metaverse. Implementing them solidly as applications is what Synflux wants to do.
Specifically, we introduced the concept of 'Lab-Driven' inside the company, a proposal came from Okamoto. This allows us to experiment freely in an agile space within the organization, maintaining a certain distance from B2B businesses with other companies – a sort of 'playground'. In this space, we are running fundamental research such as analyzing algorithmic papers and applied research such as avatar modeling experiments.
On the other hand, the 'Algorithmic Couture' project is an attempt to implement applications with the premise of implications.
'Algorithmic Couture' is an initiative to minimize fabric waste during clothing design using the methodology of algorithmic design, which has developed in the field of architecture. Its first application to mass production has been launched as 'SYN-GRID', a collaboration with Goldwin.
KawasakiIn this project, THE NORTH FACE and NEUTRALWORKS., two brands, will sell products that have reduced about one-third of their traditional waste.
'Fashion Design' & 'Design of Virtual Fashion'
MizunoOne of the features of Synflux is that the design process is structured in a nested structure that can be exchanged mutually. It allows for repeated back-and-forths between digital to physical and physical to digital.
Moreover, by enabling this mutual exchange, not only do various forms of play emerge, but also new technological developments for productization, and products themselves, making it a very meaningful process.
From the perspective of play, how do you see the relationship between legacy physical fashion design and emerging virtual fashion design, Kawasaki?
KawasakiI think a common language between the physical and informational environments has yet to be fully developed in fashion. This is a similar issue to that of architect Keisuke Toyoda, who is promoting architecture information studies, but I think there is still a lack of discussion in fashion compared to architecture, and it needs to be deepened.
Applications of advanced game engines capable of high-level physical operations and functionally simulated software like CLO3D have partially begun to spread, but traffic rules are not completely established there either. Even just focusing on design, both avatars and physical clothing use data, so we should be able to create even more optimized critical methods.
RTFKT, which handles virtual sneakers and was acquired by Nike, announced a collection of real clothes. But if clothes proposed by a decentralized organization that has been fiercely criticizing the outdated fashion industry are simply printed T-shirts, that's a bit disappointing.
SanoI thought that RTFKT might be trying to become like Supreme in the real world, selling 'starter street brand' T-shirts with just logos printed on them while trying to become a street fashion in the virtual world.
As brands that deploy in both virtual and physical worlds begin to appear one after another in the future, I think it will be interesting to see how the worldviews of the two are connected on ground.
MizunoI see. Loewe announced pixelized patterns and silhouettes in its Spring/Summer 2023 collection, which is a manifestation of 'digitization', and it seems that there is still a need for 'play'.
The common language for designing in real and virtual worlds is fragile, and the ways to bridge them are not yet fully established, it seems.
OkamotoI think we should play precisely because it's not established. In that sense, I hope Loewe continues to do what they're doing.
In the case of Synflux's work, for example, in the exhibition at '21_21 DESIGN SIGHT', we created real clothes that 'beasts' wear in a virtual world of a novel, and brought them into reality.
OkamotoIn the novel, the beasts are about 2 meters tall, but we're not that tall in real life. So we designed them so that if we wear them, we can fold back the long sleeves and the hem and stop them with buttons.
We didn't just bring them out of the virtual world as they were, but we designed the way they came out, the way they connected with our world.
We're putting this connection between different but not entirely separate worlds into our designs. Sano was in charge of the design.
We're experimenting with different ways of connecting right now. It would be boring to bring out the clothes from the novel as they are and wear them, since they wouldn't be connected in any way.
MizunoSo, you're saying that fashion design is extending from the idea of 'diegetic prototypes' that don't move but have a narrative, and only exist within certain themes based on the imagination of certain designers, like what conceptual fashion designers like Hussein Chalayan used to do, towards the idea of 'SF Prototyping' that speculates about the future in a SF way.
I get the sense that it's a sophisticated form of play to meticulously imagine a possible future using digital data, use that as a base to realize it with digital fabrication, and then play with what happens when you actually wear it.
Do you have any thoughts on the current trends in virtual fashion, Fujishima?
FujishimaWhen I talk about virtual fashion in university lectures and such, I often get questions like "Is fashion necessary even in a virtual world?" When I thought about it, I think clothes serve as an 'introduction for immersion' when humans are in a certain place.
Humans dress not only themselves but also dogs and robots. Just as fashion researcher Annamari Vänskä discussed the act of humanizing fashion by focusing on pet fashion[1], I think dressing/dressing up is linked to viewing animals and pets like humans, and the presence of clothes, the 'trace of humans', plays a very important role in establishing communication and interaction. This might provide a hint when considering the development of fashion in the metaverse.
In other words, even when we are active in the metaverse, even if we don't know whether the avatar we are talking to is a chatbot, seeing the 'trace of humans', such as the fact that the avatar is wearing customized clothes or has some statement in clothes or styling, might be an important point for us to immerse ourselves in the communication there.
MizunoSo agents like avatars in the metaverse don't necessarily have to look human. It's okay if buildings are personified and behave like humans. In the world of manga, human emotions have been expressed through non-humans using symbols like anger marks and sweat marks.
I believe what you're saying, Fujishima, is that with the help of clothing, humans and non-humans alike can become beings capable of communication. And then it becomes a discussion of what kind of clothes would make these agents interesting. Is that what you mean by 'play'?
OkamotoExactly. Right now, the concept of clothing is changing, and our clothes, even in a world that has abandoned physical things, are becoming more about expressing our identity, I think. It would be good to play a lot while such a concept is changing.
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